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Author Topic: Is the Tucson Show a good place to sell rough?  (Read 2758 times)

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John Robinson

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Is the Tucson Show a good place to sell rough?
« on: September 19, 2017, 12:42:33 PM »

I have this opal that I probably need to sell before I do something stupid with it. It is a really nice 64 ct Australian white with a rainbow pattern, with a second stone of 14 cts from the same stone (top layer).

I would love to go to the Tucson Show at some point, but having just two pieces of rough to sell does not seem like a reason to spend the money for the trip and how could I sell once I got there?

Is there someone who has a  booth there that might sell my stuff for a commmission?
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ASO

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Re: Is the Tucson Show a good place to sell rough?
« Reply #1 on: September 20, 2017, 09:47:55 AM »

In the past I went to the Tucson show as a non vendor or buyer.  Everything gets very very expensive so unless you are in driving distance from the city you would most likely spend more than you would make selling your stones.  I do have a booth at the Pueblo gem show in January and February 2018 and would advise against doing freelance selling, some vendors can get worked up about it because of all the planning and expenses that go into exhibiting at Tucson and it is very expensive Ill be in for over $20000 this year.  I do sell on commission and could probably help you out as much of my inventory is obtained that way but would recommend that you keep the stones and work on your skills as a cutter, ask advice, or have someone cut them for you.  Try putting some pictures up so more members can put in opinions as to what to do with them. 
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Phishisgroovin

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Re: Is the Tucson Show a good place to sell rough?
« Reply #2 on: September 20, 2017, 01:41:54 PM »

post a photo of it. whats it worth?
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Phishisgroovin

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Re: Is the Tucson Show a good place to sell rough?
« Reply #3 on: September 20, 2017, 01:43:58 PM »

$20K to sell at a show?
Thats obsurd, unless you sell $400,000+ in rough and finished pieces there.
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ASO

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Re: Is the Tucson Show a good place to sell rough?
« Reply #4 on: September 20, 2017, 03:06:12 PM »

Some people sell Millions at Tucson but it takes allot of time, preparation, and money.  I have a 10x10" booth in a soso location at a ok show and just the space cost me $4000 for 2 weeks.  No lighting, no advertising, no signage, no showcases, or anything.  I'm newer to the trade show seen so I will have to buy allot more things this first year out their and will be leaving it all except for my inventory at the end of the show in a storage locker.  Being new to the Tucson show you have to spend allot more on advertising so buyers know who you are, what you sell and where to find you, most buyers go back to the same sellers in the same location year after year.  Next year I plan on having a booth at 2 different shows one for 2 weeks and the other for 3 but those shows don't cost as much as other shorter shows can.  At the AGTA and GJX shows depending on the size of your booth you can spend I believe $15000 or so for a 5 day show.  By the time you add in buying or renting show cases the booth space, lighting, hotel or house rental for the length of the show, rental car, food, advertising, plane tickets, and all the little things it can really add up.  We should have around 3mil in inventory much of it being rough and rubs on display at Tucson this year so the chance of having good sales is there but from what I here the first 2 or 3 years is a bit slower for new exhibitors because buyers who go every year already know what they want, who to go see, how much they are going to spend, and generally do all of that with the same sellers.  Buyers might only perches a small amount from new sellers to test how reliable they are over the first couple years.  Allot of people go to Quartzsite AZ for a cheaper show that time of year.  Tucson is plenty big enough for a whole discussion on so hit me up if you want.
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ASO

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Re: Is the Tucson Show a good place to sell rough?
« Reply #5 on: September 20, 2017, 03:29:53 PM »

To go back and answer the original question that started this topic Yes Tucson is a great place to sell rough (as a vendor) because you have the largest amount of buyers who are in the market.  You can show up before the show and go around and see if any dealers want to buy some extra rough to bump up their inventory but I wouldn't just walk around during the show and try to sell.  For someone looking to buy rough the show is the best.  You can find some really good deals on many different types of cabbing and faceting rough I bought a bunch of different stuff to play with last year.  Dont expect to find many good deals on opal rough, but you can find some good quality just at a premium.  The Australian opal dealers have had a hard time buying from miners lately because the miners have the internet now so they aren't in the dark on pricing anymore.  Most had a small amount or rough (except for boulder opal, plenty) because they have to save some for themselves to cut.  We plan on having a large assortment available at all price points by then. 
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John Robinson

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Re: Is the Tucson Show a good place to sell rough?
« Reply #6 on: September 20, 2017, 06:30:19 PM »

I have been told by two people who should know that they are worth at least $30 a
Ct. Even at that 30 times 78 is enough to get some good equipment etc. The reason I think that it might be worth more than $30 a ct. is that when I had the stone 'appraised' it weighed 78 Ct, not 64 cts and the color on the ends was  not  exposed and the ends looked like dead zones. I decided to grind as much potch off as I could and exposed as much color as I could, I do not think I wasted more than a  couple of cts by doing so (?)

BTW the opals  are not wet (I forgot)
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*IMG_1700.JPG (105.08 kB . 585x600 - viewed 333 times)

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*IMG_1701.JPG (108.73 kB . 600x575 - viewed 300 times)
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Bluetangclan

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Re: Is the Tucson Show a good place to sell rough?
« Reply #7 on: September 21, 2017, 06:10:26 AM »

With only two pieces, fairly nice pieces Ill give you, you are probably better off trying to sell them on Ebay or Etsy. Unless you are local, by the time you add up gas, lodgings, airfare, tickets to get in, and time you aren't going to be making much. If you find a dealer that will buy it off you there, they aren't going to pay you $30 a ct because they then need to sell it for a profit. I think though you overestimate the rarity of your rough. Its nice stuff and will make a couple nice stones, but not really rare. Being white opal I don't think a cutter would make much money if they bought it for $30 a ct. This is just my opinion however so take it with a grain of salt.
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John Robinson

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Re: Is the Tucson Show a good place to sell rough?
« Reply #8 on: September 21, 2017, 06:22:52 PM »

Thanks! I keep forgetting that white opals are the most common and therefore the least valuable. I will probably just send this off somewhere and have it m sliced up for aggregates. It has three or four layers of color and I can make a lot of diploids with it.
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jerrysg

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Re: Is the Tucson Show a good place to sell rough?
« Reply #9 on: September 21, 2017, 10:07:43 PM »

John,

I may be wrong here but I think you have a misconception as to what the "Tucson Show" is really like.  First of all, it is not one show but rather about 40+ separate shows at different venues spread out around the City of Tucson. This coming year the opening date for some (but not all) of the shows will be Friday January 25, 2018 and the closing date for almost all the shows is Sunday, February 11, 2018.  "The Main Show" which is sort of the reason all the other shows are here, runs from Thursday, February 8, 2018 to Sunday, February 11, 2018 at the Tucson Convention Center and is sponsored by The Tucson Gem and Mineral Society. The theme for the exhibits this year is "Crystals and Crystal Forms" (See below) My wife and I are members of this club and work at the show every year. This is a juried show where vendors and their exhibits must be approved by the show committee and we generally have a waiting list for vendors from year to year.  Most major museum around the world also have exhibits (not selling). I have heard it described as visiting 10 major mineral museums all in one day.

The other shows are held at venues that range from large tents erected on empty lots to the various hotels located throughout the city.  Some shows are wholesale and admission is dependent on having a tax exempt retail license; others are open to the public. Some are hybrid in that they are open to the general public but also offer special pricing to retail dealers.  Some shows are devoted to a single large vendor and others have as many as 200 separate vendors. One of the larger hotel shows is located at the Hotel City Center (formerly the Inn Suites). This is an old fashioned 2 story motel where every room has an outside door either at ground level or via an outside balcony.  There are 5 or 6 separate buildings and I would say that 80% of the rooms are rented to vendors.  In most cases vendors at each of the shows work through a show promoter who actually lease the show space, provide show services and then rent individual spaces to the specific vendors.

Hotel accommodations are in very short supply during the shows and most hotels and RV parks raise their rates into the stratosphere. I would doubt that there are many hotel rooms available at this late date.  Most regulars to the shows make their reservations for the next year during the current year's show. Best best is to find a friend living in Tucson and bunk with them. But some of the locals (not rock people) leave for the duration of the shows and rent out their houses.

Here is a link to a listing of some of the shows. It is not yet complete but can give you some idea of the extent of the shows.

http://www.tucsongemshows.net/coming.html

The wife and I live about 45 minutes outside of Tucson and, not counting the 4 days we are at The Main Show, go in about 5 or 6 other days to the other shows.  We do not have a retail license so we have never been to the wholesale shows. Also we do not go to the bead shows since our interests lie elsewhere.

Still if you are interested in lapidary and minerals, Tucson in late January and early February is like Disneyland for rock junkies and not to be missed.

There are lots of other shows around the country and depending where you live, one of them might provide the opportunity to sell your rough.

Jerry
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jerrysg

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Re: Is the Tucson Show a good place to sell rough?
« Reply #10 on: September 21, 2017, 10:16:24 PM »

ASO,

Which show are you going to be at in 2018?

Jerry
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Bluetangclan

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Re: Is the Tucson Show a good place to sell rough?
« Reply #11 on: September 22, 2017, 06:03:48 AM »

Whats a diploid? Do you mean doublet? If so, DONT! By making a doublet you just dropped the value by 75-80% if not more. They look like nice stones with really good color. You should be able to make a nice stone out of each and sell them individually for far more than you could hope to by making doublets. I think you should join a club to get access to their machines. Pick up some "cheap" rough or some stuff like Utah bacon, Peruvian pink, blue or Mexican Matrix and work on opal cutting technique. They are all opal, will look cool when finished and wont break the bank learning the methods of doing it. Green opal is very pretty to work as well.

 Better yet, I don't know what part of the country you are in but since people come from South America to learn, no one in CONUS has an excuse for being too far, go to the William Holland School for Lapidary Arts for a week or two and take an opal class with Sarah Lee. As cool as the AZ show would be to go to, William Holland will be cheaper for a fun week long boot camp in the cool mountains. I think last year it was around $380 for the week which included room and board, three meals a day by a former cruiseline chef, plus whatever the class fee is. I think Sarah Lee's class was $100 but came with a bunch of practice opal, plus her relatively cheap various grade of opal rough and type for sale. And there is greenery, lots of greenery, something that would always prevent me from moving to the South West, got to have my greens and blues, constant brown is depressing.
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John Robinson

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Re: Is the Tucson Show a good place to sell rough?
« Reply #12 on: September 22, 2017, 11:59:08 AM »

First, thanks to Jerry for such an in depth answer! I knew very little about the Tucson Show except that it was a Big show with lots of business being conducted.

As far as my opal, I can't imagine anyone dropping $2500 for a piece of rough over the internet from a new seller who is an unknown. The stone could be crazed or the person could be running a scam. I do know a lot of money changes hands over the internet between folks who have built up a good relationship over the years and that is great.

I live in the middle of nowhere so that limits what I can do...
It is a Catch 22 for me, I can not sell the stone as rough and I do not have the equipment I need to cut and mount the stone so I can sell it to buy the needed equipment (or something like that)

There are some really large highlights on the lower level the one towards the top is like a tree with branches. It is deep in the rock and hard to get a good picture
I was thinking of slicing off the top layer of color and use it for an aggregate because I think the layer underneath is better, I will post a picture to get opinions on that
Big Highlights are better than small ones, aren't they?
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*IMG_1747.JPG (88.89 kB . 516x600 - viewed 309 times)

The layer that is exposed on top does have nice highlights but they are just straight lines
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Bluetangclan

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Re: Is the Tucson Show a good place to sell rough?
« Reply #13 on: September 22, 2017, 12:23:26 PM »

Um that layer looks great. Why would you risk losing it on a maybe that could end up worth little? Again, more weight = more money. Also opals are very deceptive on where the color is and its stupidly easy to lose the color bar on a wild goose chase for better color.
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ASO

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Re: Is the Tucson Show a good place to sell rough?
« Reply #14 on: September 22, 2017, 07:10:30 PM »

To me both the stones look like easy cutters.  Just keep them as low dome free form cabs and you will be happy.  The small one has a nice blocky pattern with nice reds, and the big one has a full spectrum mackerel pattern on the top color bar much more rare so I would keep it.  Nither  off the stones would be good candidates for dublets or triplets anyway the have way too much milk not enough crystal in the bars.
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