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Gadgets, Gizmos, and Dohickeys => Cutting, Grinding, Polishing => Topic started by: vitzitziltecpatl on March 25, 2018, 06:46:16 PM

Title: Frantom CRS Gripper - Updated
Post by: vitzitziltecpatl on March 25, 2018, 06:46:16 PM
Spent the day today cleaning the new old saw. Not trying to make it look new, but just get that stinky oil sludge out of it.

Have already started gathering materials for a belt guard. Other than that, it only appears to be missing a set screw in the cross-feed and a pin to hold the vise jaw adjustment dog in place.

Believe it or not, this probably isn't our oldest saw. We have a 10" trim saw with the brand name "Victor" on it. The Victor is probably 70 years old.
Title: Re: Frantom Saw - Cleaned
Post by: Stonemon on March 25, 2018, 06:57:16 PM
Looks good!  :headbang:... I love my Frantom 24"
Title: Re: Frantom Saw - Cleaned
Post by: vitzitziltecpatl on March 25, 2018, 08:06:37 PM
Oh, good - someone else with a Frantom!

Is it correct that there should be a set screw to hold the cross-feed in place, and a pin through the two holes in the lower flanges of the vise jaw adjuster? The pin would keep the adjuster assembly from moving upward through the base of the vise jaw. I couldn't find any old manuals online, so am just going by what looks logical.

The guy we got the saw from said the arbor bearings/bushings should be replaced. There is some slop in there, but I've seen worse. He mentioned some variation in slab thickness, but if the cross-feed moves and the vise jaw isn't locked down the way it was designed to be, both could also contribute to the problem.

I'm itchin' to try this saw out, but I won't be running it until I get a belt guard on it. All those belts and pulleys stickin' out into the room make me nervous. There was just no other good place to put it, so I'll be bending sheet metal soon!
Title: Re: Frantom Saw - Cleaned
Post by: Jhon P on March 26, 2018, 07:16:46 AM
I have the same saw. Except that I sanded and painted it
It’s worked great, working on may third blade. The only problem I have had was the half nut. It stripped out, easy fix I ground the faces down a little and clamped them in a vice and rethreaded it.
The 60 YO motor died last year and had to be replaced.
What is that device in the vice? Take a better picture of it. If it came with I didn’t get one. Looks like it will get in the way of a small rock or a big rock?
Title: Re: Frantom Saw - Cleaned
Post by: Stonemon on March 26, 2018, 07:42:36 AM
My saw does not have any kind of lock on the cross-feed. It stays put just fine and the slabs come off even. I will take a look at the vise jaw and see if I can help with the pin question.
I have my saw in the corner of the shop where the belts and pulleys are not exposed. I also keep the traffic down in the shop when things are running just as a rule.
Looks like a T-egg clamp in the vise?
I am pretty sure you will love this saw when you get it rolling!
Title: Re: Frantom Saw - Cleaned
Post by: Phishisgroovin on March 26, 2018, 07:55:45 AM
thats a nice saw.
I like the attachment on the back of the blade.
I am looking for an old fender from a cruiser bicycle to put in my saw to keep the oils from splashing onto the back of my case.
I have an oil slick on my patio due to the oil that leaks from the hinged area.
Title: Re: Frantom Saw - Cleaned
Post by: vitzitziltecpatl on March 26, 2018, 08:07:14 AM
Hi Jhon. The device in the vice is a CRS Gripper. Here's a video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E3wZau6pd4E .
Title: Re: Frantom Saw - Cleaned
Post by: Jhon P on March 26, 2018, 10:17:11 AM
That’s interesting. Have you used it? How well dose it work? It looks like it would work for thunder eggs and geodes too
Title: Re: Frantom Saw - Cleaned
Post by: Stonemon on March 26, 2018, 11:01:46 AM
Hey Vince,
Here are a couple of pic of my saw. Please forgive the rock snot. I just finished a big run of Rocky Butte and have not cleaned up the saw yet.
As you can see, the cross feed does not have a bore so never had a lock of any kind.
The vise dog is simpler than yours. It appears yours had a screw grease cap or something on the left side. The dog on my saw lifts out when loose and then drops back in at the chosen location.
So, a couple possibilities. You said that the saw had vegetable oil in it when your got it. Perhaps the increased friction of the lower grade cutting oil allowed the carriage speed to overtake the blades ability to cut, thereby causing the blade to bind and cut a wonky slab. This can be exaggerated by any slop in the carriage.
Also check the alignment of the carriage to the blade... all the usual suspects. Arbor bearings...etc.
Please let me know if there is something I missed or you would like any other pictures of my saw.
Best,
Bill
Title: Re: Frantom Saw - Cleaned
Post by: vitzitziltecpatl on March 26, 2018, 09:12:55 PM
Hi all. Yeah, Phish, the splash guard above the blade was a good addition by a previous owner. I'm thinkin' it should keep more of the oil on the blade for sure.

I haven't tried the "Gripper" yet, but I was impressed by the video. Both people I know in our club who've had them raved about them, and they're both geode and specimen collectors. Am already thinking of using some epoxy to put hard rubber pads on the tips. The guy we got the saw from shortened them a bit by cutting too close.

Good to see other Frantoms! Ours has a threaded hole above the cross-feed shaft, but the only set screw I had that size was pretty short and didn't hold it. I thought I'd try a longer one, just 'cuz I assumed that's why the hole is there. Since your vise dog just lifts out too, sounds like that's also by design.

There is a channel under each side of the opening in the vise jaw base, though, that would accept the ends of a pin running through the holes in the "ears" of the vice dog. That would add a leverage point between the back of the vise jaw and the slot in the carriage. Tighten up against the back of the jaw, the pin comes up against the bottom of the plate, and the dog rotates on the pin holding the dog down tighter in the carriage slot.

Ah, well - that's enough "engineering" for tonight. The droning is even putting me to sleep now... .
Title: Re: Frantom Saw - Cleaned
Post by: Sandsave on March 27, 2018, 03:48:23 PM
I have the exact saw, they don't make them like that any more!
Title: Re: Frantom Saw - Cleaned
Post by: vitzitziltecpatl on March 27, 2018, 05:48:37 PM
Cool - at least three other people on here with Frantoms. That's a good endorsement for sure.

This one also had a light added inside the hood. Pretty useless for viewing through the top, but it should be really handy for setting up cuts. I just need to add an inline switch on the cord to make it more convenient.
Title: Re: Frantom Saw - Cleaned
Post by: Sandsave on March 28, 2018, 07:24:36 AM
That switch on the front should work, they come with a small hook that you can attach to the switch and chain inside you can adjust to the size material your cutting to shut off the motor. Whoever designed these saws was awesome.
I guess you wouldn't need the light on while cutting though.
Title: Re: Frantom Saw - Cleaned
Post by: vitzitziltecpatl on March 28, 2018, 08:55:33 AM
Yeah, I just need to re-mangle the wire on the outside so it will work. The guy we got it from didn't use it for some reason.

I might fire this thing up this weekend, even if with only a temporary barrier on the pulley side. Can't stand it any longer.

From what I've read on here, I'll just stick a plug in the hole above the cross-feed shaft to keep the muck out. Make sure it's clean, put some oil or grease in there and put that set screw in to keep it clean.
Title: Re: Frantom Saw - Cleaned
Post by: Sandsave on March 28, 2018, 06:59:16 PM
I use it occasionally, the pulley system I use more often , right now I'm cutting soft material so I gave it on the small pulley to cut faster, some of the agates I've cut I'll move it back to the largest one takes all of one minute, great design!
Title: Re: Frantom Saw - Cleaned
Post by: Slabbercabber on March 29, 2018, 03:00:30 AM
If there is a bushing in that shaft guide then I would guess the threaded hole originally held a grease zirk.  Your local hardware store will have them for less than a dollar.  Grease would keep rock snot out of the bushing.
Title: Re: Frantom CRS Gripper
Post by: vitzitziltecpatl on April 01, 2018, 03:17:49 PM
Gettin' close to firing this thing up. Just put some 30W in that hole and stuck my set screw in. I should pack it with grease.

For all you guys wondering about the "Gripper" that was sitting in the saw vise, here's a photo. Try putting that rock in a standard vise, eh?

It's just barely in the pads on the Gripper, but I tried to pull/twist/break it out of there and only rocked the carriage a bit.

I also put a piece of 3/8" dop stick through the holes in the vise jaw dog ears. It does make it more solid. I wonder why none of our saws had a pin there, though. I hope there wasn't a problem years ago with the vise jaw bases cracking.
Title: Re: Frantom CRS Gripper
Post by: vitzitziltecpatl on April 03, 2018, 07:12:25 AM
Did fire it up with a temporary barrier in front of the pulleys. Gripper works great.
Title: Re: Frantom CRS Gripper
Post by: jim tawes on April 03, 2018, 02:25:47 PM
you cannot beat aFrantom 24 , I have had mine 6 months and love it, had to have cigar box rocks make me new dogs and they did a great job.  mine has asump and only takes 2.5 gals of oil which I change and filter often.  still on the original 301? blade. 
Title: Re: Frantom CRS Gripper
Post by: vitzitziltecpatl on April 03, 2018, 05:11:15 PM
Great to hear from another happy Frantom owner. This one's only 18", but we only had a 14" drop saw before getting it.

Also good to put in a plug for Cigar Box Rock. Robin bought a refurbished HP 10" from Tim for my birthday last year. We have always been happy with what we've gotten from CBR.
Title: Re: Frantom CRS Gripper
Post by: sammygator on April 11, 2018, 11:02:06 AM
Spent the day today cleaning the new old saw. Not trying to make it look new, but just get that stinky oil sludge out of it.

Have already started gathering materials for a belt guard. Other than that, it only appears to be missing a set screw in the cross-feed and a pin to hold the vise jaw adjustment dog in place.

Believe it or not, this probably isn't our oldest saw. We have a 10" trim saw with the brand name "Victor" on it. The Victor is probably 70 years old.
I've got a Frantom 24'', too. I'll try to get a few pics of it to post here.

Sam

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Frantom CRS Gripper
Post by: vitzitziltecpatl on April 26, 2018, 09:37:10 PM
Time for an update on our "new" Frantom.

Took out some freeplay in the vise carriage feed screw. It had probably .200" on each end, so I took out maybe half of that after noticing a little side-to-side movement in it. Seems to be meshed better with the drive gear in the back now, and it has been cutting very true slabs.

The other thing I've added is an allthread brace rod for the back side of the vise. There was a threaded hole just below the upper-right bolt that holds the wood liner to the vise jaw, but no hole in the wood. A cap nut on the end to keep it from digging into the other wood liner and a nut and washer inside the adjustable jaw, and it works great. Now I can chuck a piece up just inside the vise jaws near the blade without having the adjustable jaw want to cock sideways.

Having all kinds of fun with this thing...!
Title: Re: Frantom CRS Gripper
Post by: Slabbercabber on April 27, 2018, 03:51:27 AM
I love that extra screw idea.  I'm pretty sure some previous owner added that.  I'm going to do it to mine next time i"m working on it.
Title: Re: Frantom CRS Gripper
Post by: vitzitziltecpatl on April 27, 2018, 07:04:34 AM
Yeah, it sure helps to have the jaws on any vise stay square when the workpiece doesn't sit in the middle of the jaws. The tapped hole in this one was 3/8-16, and the 3/8" allthread seems like it will be sturdy enough.

I'd be interested in hearing how much front-to-back freeplay other Frantom owners have in the feed drive screws. I just guesstimated how much to leave in our saw. Didn't want to force it too tightly into the drive gearbox in the back... .
Title: Re: Frantom CRS Gripper
Post by: finegemdesigns on June 08, 2018, 10:50:02 AM
That setup looks like it could bend and create problems. Just my opinion and 2 cents.

I like this tool:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/MEDIUM-ROCK-CLAMP-for-12-to-24-slab-saws-Holds-end-cuts-hard-to-hold-rocks/232792631502?hash=item363385a8ce:g:b1UAAOSwmmxW6XL~

(https://www.zbestvalue.com/Slab-Grabbers/rockclamplarge.jpg)

Comes in smaller size as well.

(https://www.zbestvalue.com/Slab-Grabbers/smallrockclamp.jpg)
Title: Re: Frantom CRS Gripper
Post by: 55fossil on June 08, 2018, 02:24:03 PM
ie Jaw Freeplay;   My Frantom has tons of freeplay left to right.  I often stick wood blocks on one side of the jaw to help keep it square. Large rocks that only go a few inches into the jaw really make my vice go sideways.  I like the threaded rod and am considering something similar for my Frantom. Possibly a heavier threaded rod.   nice photo....
Title: Re: Frantom CRS Gripper
Post by: vitzitziltecpatl on June 09, 2018, 07:59:10 PM
Thanks for the info on your Frantom. How much space is there between the collars and the inside wall of the cabinet at each end of the drive screw?

Re possible bending of the CRS Gripper - it seems to be bulletproof. I've already tested this one thoroughly, and the other two people in our club who have them have "abused" theirs for years now with no problems.
Title: Re: Frantom CRS Gripper
Post by: kanecats on June 14, 2018, 09:33:08 AM
Hi Frantom peoples :)

I just bought a 14" Frantom and will attach pics. The saw has a blown motor, and I would like to ask recommendations on the size motor to replace the original with. The GE 1/3 Hp motor seems a little light to me and wanted some opinions. I plan to take this apart and replace bearings, belts and other needed items. Does anyone know the bearing size for this? I pick up the machine next week and would like to get this stuff in and be ready to go! If any of you have any suggestions based on my pics, your opinions and suggestions are welcomed! First order of business is sandblasting and paint. The hood is dented, and I am considering getting an estimate to have it straightened and add a lip to the inside hood so the oil stays in the machine. Is that necessary in your experience? 

Regarding the motor-does it have a .625 diameter shaft? I am considering a Baldor engine. I am also wondering if going with a 220 line would be a better option to the 110?

The machine came from a 96 year old who passed. It was his machine from new.

Thanks! Diana
Title: Re: Frantom CRS Gripper - Updated
Post by: vitzitziltecpatl on June 14, 2018, 06:38:11 PM
Good for you! A "one-owner" saw. Should be a good one. Sorry I don't know part sizes for the 14", but I'll bet someone on here will have info for you. Do know our 14" drop saw has a 1/3 HP motor, and I've considered upgrading to a 1/2 horse.

I see your saw has a threaded rod to keep the vice jaw square. Does it also have a rod holding the ears of the "dog" in the slot on the vice carriage itself? Or does your dog just lift up out of the slot when not under pressure?

I also see in the 5th photo (from above the vice) that the collar on the back end of the drive screw appears to be tight up against the inside of the cabinet. Our 18" had almost 1/4" space between the collar and the cabinet walls, both front and back. I took most of that front-to-back freeplay out, but didn't want to bind anything up by taking it all out.

Just from the number of members here who've posted about their Frantoms, I wonder how many of these saws are still out there. They were obviously built to last!
Title: Re: Frantom CRS Gripper - Updated
Post by: vitzitziltecpatl on September 15, 2018, 06:04:38 PM
Have new photos of the "Gripper" in action. It has been rotated to get the best slabs from a small odd-shaped rock. There are two bolts to loosen (head of one is visible in the first photo) on the base which then allow the arms to be rotated.

This was also a very irregularly shaped piece of rough. Three more slabs came off after these photos, and it never moved.
Title: Re: Frantom CRS Gripper
Post by: ARTIZANCA on March 23, 2022, 12:11:28 AM
Hi Frantom peoples :)

I just bought a 14" Frantom and will attach pics. . . .
. . . . .
The machine came from a 96 year old who passed. It was his machine from new.

Thanks! Diana


Very nice find, I also just got a 24 inch Frantom but not as good condition as yours. I will post pics. Mine is missing the motor but I got one in an auction for $10 a couple weeks ago, coincidence. Also, I needs rewiring and a real good cleaning and paint.